IETF
spring
spring@jabber.ietf.org
Monday, July 26, 2021< ^ >
martin-vx has set the subject to: IETF-110
Room Configuration
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[18:52:22] <Alessandro Toppi_web_119> I see you managed it Joel :-) it works
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[18:52:58] <Joel Halpern_web_884> Thanks Alessandro
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[18:56:26] <Loa Andersson_web_682> At the top of chat window it says "Topic has been set to IETF 110"
[18:56:43] <Loa Andersson_web_682> Should be IETF 111
[18:56:51] <Joel Halpern_web_884> /topic SPRING session IETF 111
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[18:57:07] <Joel Halpern_web_884> I don't know the code to hang the topic.
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[18:57:49] <Loa Andersson_web_682> are the meetecho folks around?
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[18:58:00] <Alessandro Toppi_web_119> @Loa yes we are
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[18:58:28] <Loa Andersson_web_682> can you change the topic of the chat panel?
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[18:58:33] <Loa Andersson_web_682> to IETF 111
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[18:58:38] <Joel Halpern_web_884> @Alessandro what is the string I use to change the topic?
[18:58:42] dhruvdhody has set the subject to: IETF-111
[18:58:47] <Meetecho> Loa: that's the Jabber room topic
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[18:58:57] <JimG> Dhruv to the rescue thanks Dhruv!
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[18:59:00] <Dhruv Dhody_web_358> I did it via jabber
[18:59:00] <Meetecho> If you change it there it should change in Meetecho too
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[18:59:24] <Joel Halpern_web_884> Thanks Dhruv.   For future reference, what is the magic string?
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[18:59:26] <Loa Andersson_web_682> hmmm -  then I can't do anything, anyone?
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[18:59:50] <Loa Andersson_web_682> now it says both :)
[18:59:57] <Ole Trøan_web_195> Anyone else seeing blurry slides?
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[19:00:17] <Erik Kline_web_381> slightly, yes
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[19:00:19] <Daniam Henriques_web_778> Ole, yeah I am, horizontally stretched
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[19:00:24] <Joel Halpern_web_884> The presentation technique slightly reduces slide resolution.  So they will all look a little blurry.  But much easier to maange.
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[19:00:36] <Loa Andersson_web_682> I just see Note Well
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[19:00:53] <Joel Halpern_web_884> Yes, we are showing the Note well slide as we wait for the meeting.
[19:00:59] <Éric Vyncke_web_451> OTOH unsure whether I would survive one week of blurry slides :-(
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[19:01:01] <Joel Halpern_web_884> Which we will start momentarily.
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[19:01:58] <Jeffrey Haas_web_339> FWIW Bruno, you seem to be on an open laptop microphone rather than a headset and are muffled as a result.
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[19:04:49] <Éric Vyncke_web_451> A lot of background noise indeed
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[19:06:01] <Lenny Giuliano_web_258> Hmm, I'm getting no audio at all.  "audio in 0 kbps".  Anyone else having this problem, or am I just lucky?
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[19:06:20] <Tom Hill_web_880> I think you are the lucky one, Lenny
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[19:06:29] <Jeffrey Haas_web_339> try hitting reconnect, bottom right of window, Lenny
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[19:06:45] <Meetecho> The audio reconnect button is in the bottom-right
[19:06:48] <Shraddha Hegde_web_122> for me also audio in 0 kbps
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[19:06:59] <Meetecho> Circling arrows icon
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[19:07:21] <Shraddha Hegde_web_122> reconnecting audio didnt help
[19:07:27] <Lenny Giuliano_web_258> tried reconnecting audio, no luck
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[19:08:18] <Eduard V_web_548> any firewall on the path?
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[19:08:25] <Meetecho> What browser?
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[19:08:33] <Lenny Giuliano_web_259> I'm sure there are many
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[19:08:53] <Lenny Giuliano_web_259> firewalls in the path.  everything else seems to work.  using firefox
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[19:09:42] <Meetecho> Lenny: on MacOS?
[19:09:44] <Chris Bowers_web_700> try disconnecting from any VPN
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[19:09:51] <Bob Hinden_web_658> This slide is illegible
[19:09:54] <Boris Khasanov_web_690> quite hard to see the text on the color background
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[19:10:10] <Lenny Giuliano_web_259> Yes, macOS
[19:10:18] <Shraddha Hegde_web_347> disconnecting from VPN worked for me
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[19:11:23] <Lenny Giuliano_web_444> Disconnecting VPN did the trick.  Thanks Chris and Shraddha
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[19:11:23] <Meetecho> Lenny: I remember we had an issue in that combo, but we prepared a fix. Not sure if it's not working for you. Do you have another browser you can try for a test?
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[19:11:45] <Meetecho> Ah ok, just saw the VPN update
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[19:12:56] <Joel Halpern_web_884> The resolution reduction seems to have done a nasty job on the lighter gray text.
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[19:14:20] <Éric Vyncke_web_451> @meetecho @Joel is right: some slides are mostly unreadable due to the too efficient compression
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[19:15:09] <Meetecho> Eric: ack, thanks, we'll try to fine tune it for next time
[19:15:11] <Meetecho> Sorry about that :(
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[19:15:19] <Éric Vyncke_web_451> thx
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[19:16:14] <Joel Halpern_web_884> @alessandro The private chat window blocks the "next slide" icon.
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[19:17:06] <Bob Hinden_web_658> This slide is truncated :-(
[19:17:07] <JimG> whoever is continually tapping could you please stop
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[19:17:20] <Alessandro Toppi_web_119> @joel: ack, we'll take a look
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[19:18:02] <Ville Hallivuori_web_189> That "tapping" sounds suspiciously like rain...
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[19:18:29] <Alessandro Toppi_web_119> @JimG: the tapping sound seems to come from the speaker
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[19:19:28] <Ole Trøan_web_195> Either it's raining or one of the chairs is typing vigorously...
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[19:19:57] <Joel Halpern_web_884> Even the chairs have self-muted.
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[19:20:02] <Tony Li_web_458> Gerbil powered laptop?
[19:20:05] <Eduard V_web_548> probably notes
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[19:21:50] <Shuping Peng_web_192> It is raining in Beijing.
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[19:22:15] <Kireeti Kompella_web_550> no audio in here ... suggestions?
[19:22:17] <Erik Kline_web_381> (we need some of that rain in California!)
[19:22:31] <Shuping Peng_web_192> Nobody is typing notes now
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[19:22:47] <Shraddha Hegde_web_347> @kireeti  disconnect from VPN
[19:22:48] <Tony Li_web_458> @Kireeti Disconnect from VPN
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[19:22:59] <Andrew Alston_web_349> :) I could do with some rain here - 32C at midnight here right now - something to cool down would be good
[19:23:02] <Bill Fenner_web_146> Also, Kireeti, there's a "reconnect" button (two curved arrows) in the lower right
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[19:24:28] <Kireeti Kompella_web_550> tried that.  switching to Firefox (says the apple fanboy on safari)
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[19:24:40] <Joel Halpern_web_884> @Alessandro - also, if it is telling me that it is modifying the audio or video (the light blue popup) that masks the button to advance the slides.
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[19:25:11] <Jeff Tantsura_web_583> firefox works well, both presenters and attendees
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[19:25:33] <Meetecho> Joel: ack, it's probably all happening in an unfortunate position :)
[19:25:33] <Alessandro Toppi_web_119> @Joel: thanks, reporting it
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[19:25:41] <Meetecho> Notice you can also change slide by clocing the slide number itself
[19:25:50] <Meetecho> *clicking
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[19:26:04] <Joel Halpern_web_884> That would help some of the time.  Thanks.
[19:26:10] <Meetecho> A bit more cumbersome but may help when the next button is covered
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[19:28:01] <Joel Halpern_web_884> It is better.
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[19:28:23] <Kireeti Kompella_web_911> @jeff agreed. I knew this (did ietf 110 on ff), had to relearn :(
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[19:31:13] <Meetecho> Joel: PS, you can also navigate slides using left/right arrow keys (if the focus is not on the jabber room text input, I believe)
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[19:31:38] <Joel Halpern_web_884> Have to try that on the next deck.
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[19:33:06] <Tom Hill_web_880> Lotta wind noise coming from you, I think Joel?
[19:33:10] <Tom Hill_web_880> Are you outside? :D
[19:33:11] <Andrew Stone_web_705> fyi Joel, sounds like there might be a fan periodically creating wave effects on your mic
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[19:33:38] <Stewart Bryant_web_208> Please could the person with wind noise mute
[19:34:02] <Joel Halpern_web_884> The wind noise is me.  I am torn between muting and needing to move things along.  Will try to stay muted more.
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[19:35:41] <Tony Li_web_458> This member would like to see SRv6 be deprecated.
[19:35:45] <Andrew Alston_web_349> my take on this is adopt all of them - they have different use cases as well - and you have people who are prepared to work on them
[19:35:56] <Joel Halpern_web_884> @Tony - heard
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[19:36:10] <Joel Halpern_web_884> @Andrew - heard.  Please send email.
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[19:43:38] <Eduard V_web_548> Too may solutions would fraction the market. Slow down overall adoption. Not all vendors would implement all solutions that would break interoperability. Hence, solution should be one.
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[19:44:20] <Martin Vigoureux_web_697> I'd be very concerned if the WG was to restart all the DT work. Yes, that's input to the WG, but valuable input, resulting from a lot of work from from a diversity of individuals.
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[19:44:33] <Éric Vyncke_web_451> +1
[19:44:57] <Zafar Ali_web_868> +1
[19:45:07] <Kamran Raza_web_423> +1
[19:45:32] <Jeffrey Haas_web_442> Joel, the background noise is coming from your mic.Please consider aggressively muting yourself when you're not speaking.
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[19:46:53] <Joel Halpern_web_884> @Jeff.  Yes.  I am doing so.  e.g. I am muted now.
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[19:47:25] <Boris Khasanov_web_690> If more than 1 solution they should be somehow compatible or support interop (additional complexity)
[19:47:35] <Zafar Ali_web_868> I agreed with Martin. Especially because key author from each solution were part of the design team!
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[19:48:39] <Jim Guichard_web_396> @Martin the chairs would like to see mailing list discussion on the analysis so that we can take a decision on which document/s to progress
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[19:49:20] <Cheng Li_web_971> The result is a very valuable output for sure. It is hard to get all the people to agree all the text in the DT. So hope you guys can read the text if you have free time.
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[19:50:10] <Ron Bonica_web_665> Zafar, Actually, this is not true. The design team included 7 individuals. 5 were co-authors of CSID, 1 CRH, 1 UIDSR, 0 VSID
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[19:51:05] <Cheng Li_web_971> BTW, over 10 vendors have made their choices and finished the interop-test in the past year. This year, our customers around the world need the solution.
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[19:51:36] <Stewart Bryant_web_208> If node N1 advertises the N SIDat a hight cost wouldn't normal FRR fix this?
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[19:51:41] <Jim Guichard_web_396> @everyone please send your comments on analysis to the mailing list - if you believe only a single solution should be moved forward say so, if multiple then say that too - the chairs are looking for guidance from the WG rather than taking a decision without WG input
[19:51:46] <Darren Dukes_web_715> @ron, I believe your accounting is not correct Ron.
[19:52:12] <daniel.bernier@bell.ca_web_108> I agree with Martin, prior to the design team we were arguing in face to face meetings and perpetually on the the mailing list ... which triggered the creation of a design team if I remember correctly. If the end result of this effort is to again await ML discussions to come up with agreement, we might might end up with DT#2
[19:52:38] <daniel.bernier@bell.ca_web_108> @Jim will add my latest comment to the list
[19:52:44] <daniel.bernier@bell.ca_web_108> thansk
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[19:53:24] <Jim Guichard_web_396> @daniel the chairs will make a decision one way or another but we would prefer to do that based upon WG input and feedback on the DT work outputs
[19:53:45] <Ron Bonica_web_665> Maybe the solution is to let multiple solutions proceed and let the marketplace decide
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[19:54:36] <Ron Bonica_web_665> After all, the marketplace knows best what it wants
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[19:55:56] <daniel.bernier@bell.ca_web_108> 10-4 @Jim
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[19:58:04] <Boris Khasanov_web_690> so  poor customers have to carry the burden of integration all 4 compression solutions if they don't want  to have single vendor lock in.
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[19:59:26] <Ron Bonica_web_665> Or they force their vendors to implement the solution they want?
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[20:00:31] <Tony Li_web_458> And customers all want the same thing???
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[20:00:59] <Tony Li_web_458> You end up with customers wanting all four and the vendors having to do all 4. No thank you.
[20:01:12] <Kireeti Kompella_web_262> and can actually force their vendors to do anything meaningful?
[20:01:23] <Tony Li_web_458> I propose that we just roll dice.
[20:01:42] <Daniam Henriques_web_778> Boris, or the freedom to choose a solution that's optimized to their particular constraints and design philosophy. I don't feel that the proposed solutions are all created to address the exact same set of requirements, each makes their own trade-offs and some may need to be assessed as stand-alone solutions to specific requirements.
[20:01:47] <Boris Khasanov_web_690> depends on the size of the customer and their budget to persuade a vendor
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[20:02:14] <Kireeti Kompella_web_262> @tony dice are loaded (by market cap)
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[20:02:35] <Tony Li_web_458> I mean that quite literally.
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[20:03:10] <Kireeti Kompella_web_262> as did i
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[20:03:53] <Eduard V_web_548> I do not remember any other IETF functionality that was duplicated in 4 solutions. Does anybody remember any?
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[20:04:46] <Ron Bonica_web_665> Four solutions is excessive. Maybe we can decide on a number of lanes (greater than 1) and allow one solution in each lane.
[20:04:59] <Martin Horneffer_web_198> Maybe I'm with an operator (=customer) that is too small... but anyways: with all the options in IETF standards it already is a pain to get interoperability for any new functionality. I really don't need even more variety in new standards.
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[20:05:47] <Bill Fenner_web_146> Eduard, MANET basically declared failure after failing to pick among 4 protocols
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[20:05:55] <Kireeti Kompella_web_262> @eduard vpls bgp/vpls ldp/evpn = 3
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[20:06:18] <Kireeti Kompella_web_262> all deployed, but evpn is "winning"
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[20:06:43] <Eduard V_web_548> no, EVPN is just the replacement. Hence 2.
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[20:06:55] <Kireeti Kompella_web_262> service is the same
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[20:07:10] <Eduard V_web_548> And I remember a lot of interoperability problem from these 2.
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[20:07:46] <Boris Khasanov_web_690> Kireeti, there were good old days  when we just have to choose between ldp or bgp signaling :)
[20:07:47] <Kireeti Kompella_web_262> keeps life interesting :)
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[20:08:04] <Eduard V_web_548> the last one is for sure
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[20:09:46] <fang sheng_web_886> You can detect the link fault of the directly connected neighbor to determine whether the neighbor is faulty.
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[20:12:48] <Darren Dukes_web_715> Why adopt >1?  The design team was formed to inform the WG of requirements and analysis for compressing an SRv6 SID list.  We have a clear collaboration with interoperable solutions around CSID, and it meets all requirements to the maximum. This isn't just my opinion.  It is the unanimous consensus of the design team that spent 1 year working on this.  I guess we can bring this to the list.
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[20:23:15] <Joel Halpern_web_884> @meetecho the windows blocking the advancement are particularly bad when I need to terminate the current share.   Is there a keystroke to do that?
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[20:24:17] <Meetecho> Joel: you can terminate it in the upper left too
[20:24:22] <Meetecho> From where you started it
[20:24:26] <alexamirante-meetecho> Joel Halpern_web_884: unfortunately not. But if you need to stop the slide share, an alternative might be to click on the button on the top-left corner?
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[20:25:00] <Joel Halpern_web_884> Thanks.  Those may work.  
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[20:37:56] <János Farkas_web_638> Well, relationship with DetNet is not clear. Perhaps join the DetNet session for https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/111/materials/slides-111-detnet-detnet-data-plane-preof-for-ip-00.pdf#page=3
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[20:42:00] <Éric Vyncke_web_816> Unsure why there is a need for a CA in this case
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[20:42:37] <Eduard V_web_548> Does it mean that SRH would be extended cross-domain?
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[20:42:53] <Éric Vyncke_web_816> In this case, a CA could become useful indeed
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[20:48:16] <chenmeiling_web_713> yes
[20:48:39] <chenmeiling_web_713> CA certificate used in the controller
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[20:51:29] <Éric Vyncke_web_816> @Meiling: why not simply distributing the public keys per ingress node (as all is done via a controller) ?
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[20:52:02] <Éric Vyncke_web_816> About alt-mark, 3 different ways (SRH, HbH, dest options) of doing the same marking?
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[20:58:53] <chenmeiling_web_713> the range of signatures includes IPv6 Source address, SRH
Last Entry, SRH Flags, SRH Segment List, AUTH TLV D, AUTH TLV
Reserved, AUTH TLV Auth Key ID.
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[21:00:17] <fang sheng_web_886> If the sid list uses enc.x, can it still be swapped?
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[21:00:39] <fang sheng_web_886> end.x'
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[21:01:02] <chenmeiling_web_713> we are not limited to ingress node, we can choose the key node to verify the signature.
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[21:02:24] <chenmeiling_web_713> just key node need public key for verification.
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