IETF
httpbis
httpbis@jabber.ietf.org
Monday, July 22, 2019< ^ >
ted.h has set the subject to: https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/104/materials/agenda-104-httpbis/
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[19:49:50] <Julian Reschke> there's some strange noise on the audio
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[19:50:28] <dschinazi@jab.im> meetecho: can you investigate this noise report please?
[19:50:36] <Meetecho> Julian Reschke: they haven't started speaking yet. so what you get is the background noise
[19:50:47] <Meetecho> Improving now?
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[19:51:01] <Julian Reschke> actually, it was local noise
[19:51:06] <Meetecho> (y)
[19:51:13] <Julian Reschke> :-)
[19:51:37] <Roy Fielding> 8)
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[19:52:27] <Julian Reschke> s/tuesday/monday/
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[20:01:27] <Roy Fielding> +1 to draft-ietf-httpbis-digest-headers-00 but it might be nice to have a litle more discussion in draft about why the authors think these fields will be useful in future
[20:02:14] <Roy Fielding> both
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[20:02:45] <joehall> red button broken @meetechoweblite
[20:02:47] <Jonathan Lennox> Meetecho: Our red button does not seem to be working
[20:02:52] joehall oops
[20:02:55] <alficles> Our red button in the room is broken and it's making us very sad.
[20:03:03] <Meetecho> Looking into it...
[20:03:18] <joehall> we love you @meetecho
[20:03:22] <Meetecho> :)
[20:04:14] <Meetecho> Can you try now?
[20:04:24] <Roy Fielding> never mind, my comment is just a editorial suggestion that I don't understand the need but am happy to see the fields refreshed.
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[20:04:45] <Meetecho> Sorry about that Roy! Next questions should work
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[20:06:45] <Jeffrey Yasskin> Roy Fielding: I think https://github.com/ioggstream/draft-polli-resource-digests-http/issues/15 matches your request for use cases.
[20:08:51] <Roy Fielding> yep, thanks
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[20:11:11] <Jeffrey Yasskin> Roy Fielding: Note that that issue didn't make it over to the httpbis repository, and I haven't checked that it's solved in the newest editor's draft, so you're welcome to re-open it in the new place.
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[20:16:27] <lucasp> @roy I rather stupidly forgot a backup slide (9) that we had which mentions some uses: web payments and web packaging. Generally on it's own the Digest header is not super useful. It gets better when combined with some mechanism to protect HTTP metadata. This allows for L7 protections that transcend transport. So for instance, you could compose a resource from partial content retrieved from different sources and validate the resource's integrity before passing it to application for processing.
[20:17:32] <Roy Fielding> @lucasp I think that's fine but would prefer to see it in draft even if that's just an appendix
[20:18:16] <lucasp> ok great to know that there is a desire for it, we'll see what we can do
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[20:20:01] <alficles> I'm doing the jabber voice thing, so go ahead and use a "mic:" prefix or similar so I know when I to voice you at the mic.
[20:20:25] <alficles> The conversation is great, I just want to make sure I don't miss something important at the mic.
[20:20:43] <Roy Fielding> mic: I agree when it is new information and not an existing code
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[20:25:21] <Roy Fielding> IOW (no need for mic), when Proxy-Status has new information to send that is more specific than an existing HTTP code, use a long token name -- when Proxy-Status is just saying a proxy is responsible for sending the code, use a short token (or just the code itself) in Proxy-Status instead of a long token name.
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[20:27:01] <Roy Fielding> draft-ietf-httpbis-cache-header-00
[20:27:35] <Roy Fielding> mic: I'd really really really prefer this be called Cache-Status
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[20:29:07] <Roy Fielding> (mostly because that aligns it with cache-control and potential future fields that help us isolate semantics specific to caches)
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[20:33:43] <Thomas Peterson> mic: is there not room for allowing for free-form values here for implementations that can't fit in any of these fields?
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[20:40:59] <Roy Fielding> :s
[20:41:21] <Martin Thomson> "Someone implemented my internet-draft! ♥♥🌟⭐"
[20:41:34] <dschinazi@jab.im> <3
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[20:42:40] <Roy Fielding> mic: Those all sound like core issues to me
[20:43:43] <Roy Fielding> *shrug*
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[20:52:54] <Roy Fielding> mic: do we have anyone who need float (other than int/1000)?
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[20:56:16] <Roy Fielding> mic: +1 fixed-point
[20:58:16] <Roy Fielding> +1 on whatever Martin said (no mic needed)
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[20:59:57] <Roy Fielding> mic: +1 to just sending utf-8 for structured headers
[21:01:50] <Julian Reschke> mic: it *is* this issue, in that it would resolve it
[21:02:47] <Julian Reschke> :-)
[21:02:52] <Roy Fielding> wait, what? I wasn't listening :D
[21:03:21] <alficles> Heh. I inadvertently attributed Julian's reply there to you at the mic. :)
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[21:06:57] <Roy Fielding> mic: so, we can't have a URI type because a non-standards org has an opinion about which spec to reference? >(
[21:07:23] <Julian Reschke> mic: the interop argument actually makes me think we should add this, because it would actually help the consumers
[21:07:56] <Martin Thomson> That comment pushes toward string types, which isn't a terrible outcome, is it?
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[21:08:20] <Julian Reschke> mic: because we would define how it works
[21:08:40] <Roy Fielding> mic: I don't care what the recipient does with the string -- I just want the sender to tell me it is a reference to a URI
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[21:09:08] <Julian Reschke> mic: +1 to what Roy said
[21:09:40] <Roy Fielding> mic: then why have any strong typing?
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[21:10:59] <Roy Fielding> mic: w3c is no longer a standards org, thanks
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[21:11:41] <Roy Fielding> (er, no need to mic that)
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[21:12:20] <Jeffrey Yasskin> Roy Fielding: That's nearly ad-hominem and not so helpful.
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[21:20:45] <Jonathan Lennox> Sec-CH: Dry, and Swiss.
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[21:28:20] <Martin Thomson> an off-mic comment: User-Agent becomes Sec-User-Agent?  My response: Sec-CHUA
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[21:29:03] <alficles> :D
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[21:34:02] <Jonathan Lennox> Should you use the magic words "PII" to make people appropriately alarmed?
[21:35:08] <alficles> I had the same thought. Though that might alarm a lawyer, which could make things difficult on occasion.
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[21:45:08] <Robin Marx> We do have some insight for video streaming, but not as detailed as for web page loading
[21:46:35] <alficles> Robin: Do you want that at the mic?
[21:47:08] <Robin Marx> After the presentation maybe :) You can add that we're open to exploring this further, please contact us.
[21:47:41] <alficles> Noted. We'll see if we even get a line. :)
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[21:51:57] <alficles> We are adjourned.
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[21:52:02] <alficles> Thank you all.
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