Thursday, February 16, 2017< ^ >
bortzmeyer has set the subject to: DNSOP at IETF97
Room Configuration
Room Occupants

[07:15:10] MAP leaves the room
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[18:49:42] Suzanne Woolf joins the room
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[18:50:19] <Warren Kumari> Hullo everyone!
[18:50:22] dnshane has set the subject to: virtual interim meeting
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[18:56:23] John Levine joins the room
[18:56:58] <Warren Kumari> Hi all. Here is the webex info agian:
[18:57:01] <Warren Kumari> Meeting number: 644 850 881
    Meeting password: special
    Meeting link:
[18:59:56] Duane Wessels joins the room
[19:00:22] <dnshane> DING!
[19:00:36] <Warren Kumari> DONG.
[19:01:12] <dnshane> We appear to be missing our chairs on the WebEx.
[19:01:17] <dnshane> Right?
[19:01:21] <Warren Kumari> Nope
[19:01:23] <Warren Kumari> Sec.
[19:01:42] <Warren Kumari> DNSOP Working Group is Suzanne
[19:01:47] paulwouters joins the room
[19:03:15] Hugo Salgado joins the room
[19:03:52] Andrew Sullivan joins the room
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[19:06:07] Geoff Huston joins the room
[19:07:05] <paulwouters> warren :P
[19:07:09] <paulwouters> did not work :P
[19:07:28] <Warren Kumari> Geoff, can you minute?
[19:08:12] rdroms joins the room
[19:08:16] Russ Housley joins the room
[19:11:18] <Geoff Huston> "until now"
[19:11:21] <Geoff Huston> ?
[19:12:27] <Geoff Huston> can I speak with a question to Suzanne?
[19:14:14] wes joins the room
[19:14:21] <Warren Kumari> … and we are hoping that you (Geoff) are minuting…
[19:16:23] <Andrew Sullivan> If you're not allowed to do something in the future and weren't in the past, it's still true that you haven't been allowed to do it until now.
[19:17:04] <Geoff Huston> thanks Suzanne
[19:17:42] ggm joins the room
[19:17:43] <Suzanne Woolf> thanks Andrew :)
[19:18:18] <paulwouters> no native links to slide?
[19:18:24] <paulwouters> my iphone is small :P
[19:22:06] <paulwouters> sounds issues? or large pauzes ?
[19:25:38] <Andrew Sullivan> procedural question: has the AD already said they're going to proceed with this particular problem statement?
[19:25:49] <Andrew Sullivan> The IESG has become cranky about problem statement RFCs
[19:26:32] <wes> paulwouters: I assume you're internet based sound and not phone?  (phone is fine)
[19:26:32] rdroms leaves the room
[19:26:54] <John Levine> internet sound is fine on my cable modem connection in New York
[19:27:11] <ggm> personally, I find 4.3 rather 'sotto voce' given its centrality to the problem
[19:27:31] <ggm> It feels to me like this should be a front and centre statement, not a one-paragraph buried observation
[19:27:42] <Andrew Sullivan> I think it's the right thing: the reason for prob statements for the IESG is that they're often guidance to the WG and not the world, but in this case keeping the output around seems worthwhile so that this endless maze of ratholes needn't be explored again
[19:27:56] <ggm> it is unfortunate that the cited examples at 4.1.2 are SUBDOMAINS of .arpa
[19:28:23] <ggm> the technical merit question being visibly about TLD, not subdomains. if we're arguing about sutld, why are 2LD relevant?
[19:29:57] <Geoff Huston> My hand is up
[19:31:12] <Suzanne Woolf> @Geoff it's not in webex but you're next
[19:31:39] <Geoff Huston> @#$@$$# webex!
[19:31:53] <Warren Kumari> I no longer trust the WebEx plugin (after the recent security advisory, and the
[19:32:23] <Warren Kumari> "no known mitigations"  — so I only use the browser / HTML5 verions… which apparently doesn't show hands?
[19:32:30] <dnshane> Yes... I can feel your hatred... let your anger at WebEx flow!!!
[19:32:35] <Andrew Sullivan> is a "gateway question" like a "gateway drug"?
[19:33:43] <ggm> Thank you Geoff :-)
[19:34:06] <Suzanne Woolf> @Geoff I can see a little hand icon but maybe you can't :(
[19:35:19] <ggm> there are two versions of the UI and the new material design one, doesnt seem to have it
[19:35:36] <Andrew Sullivan> I think it would be neat for us to have a draft named "TLD:R"  Now, if only we could come up with a backward construction …
[19:36:44] <ggm> that would indeed be totally neat. lets use it for something after the PS
[19:36:53] <dnshane> PS?
[19:37:16] <ggm> problem statement -> too long, didn't (read)
[19:40:32] <Warren Kumari> Oooooooh! We could try reserve the TLD "R" -> TLD:R would be a fine name :-)
[19:40:58] <Geoff Huston> Ins;t there a DOI for that?
[19:41:27] <Warren Kumari> DOI?
[19:41:49] <Warren Kumari> We could do this on April 1st…
[19:43:25] <Geoff Huston> DOI - => handles - I recall vaguely a colon in the text representation of DOIs, so TLD:R could well be a valid DOI
[19:45:00] <Warren Kumari> Hand.
[19:46:48] <Suzanne Woolf> ack Warren
[19:53:13] Ralph Droms joins the room
[19:53:36] <Andrew Sullivan> there is a mechanism for adding Privacy Considerations, so we can do that
[19:55:05] <Warren Kumari> … is the mechanism that you add a section called "Privacy Considerations"?!  :-P
[19:56:42] <ggm> <hand>
[19:57:17] <Andrew Sullivan> @Warren: yes :)
[20:00:35] <Geoff Huston> <hand>
[20:00:36] <ggm> <unhand>
[20:01:18] <Warren Kumari> <also hand>
[20:03:10] <Andrew Sullivan> I used the webex hand thing, but <hand>
[20:03:42] <Suzanne Woolf> @andrew you fell off my screen, sorry!
[20:04:40] <wes> still hand
[20:05:00] <Suzanne Woolf> Wes ok
[20:11:40] <Warren Kumari> Unsurprisingly Ralph said what I wanted to, but in a more coherent way :-)
[20:16:00] SHollenbeck leaves the room
[20:17:23] <Andrew Sullivan> Careful what you wish for here, since the IAB, of course, is the part of the IETF that interfaces with those political issues.  Are you quite sure you want to put this there?
[20:17:39] <Andrew Sullivan> (note that it won't be _my_ problem in the future)
[20:17:48] <Warren Kumari> Sad puppy.
[20:18:37] <Andrew Sullivan> hand
[20:19:10] <Ralph Droms> <hand back up>
[20:19:23] <Geoff Huston> the IAB is "us" to the same extent that the IESG is "us" - I have no problem with the IAB making decisions on this per se - I have a problem with vague and poorly drafted procedures that put individual IAB members on the spot by having to extemporize and be creative!
[20:19:31] <Warren Kumari> Hand!
[20:19:37] <Ralph Droms> I have a different interpretation of where policy decisions get made.
[20:19:40] <Geoff Huston> you have two Warren
[20:19:47] <Geoff Huston> (hands)
[20:19:52] <Ralph Droms> <I think I'm about to say the same words as Andrew>
[20:20:47] <Ralph Droms> <hand down>  I agree with Andrew.
[20:20:54] <Suzanne Woolf> ack Ralph
[20:23:14] <Andrew Sullivan> I do not want to re-insert in the queue, but if Wes's argument (which might have been George's and Geoff's as well) is that the IETF is not competent to deal with this level of politics — a proposition with which I probably agree — then that's a decision the IETF needs to make explicitly.
[20:23:28] <Andrew Sullivan> so far it has declined to do so
[20:24:25] <ggm> I think there is a lot in that sentence Andrew, but probably yes, its the tenor of my argument.
[20:24:41] <ggm> DNSOP can inform to technical matters and could, although i suspect unwisely propose process
[20:25:08] <ggm> but the *decision* lies way up the food chain and is probably an inter-agency decision. we're not able to make unique, binding decisions here. we're now in a world where other agencies have a role to play
[20:25:39] <ggm> and I think saying "this problem lies above our functional level, and is not in our technical role" is a good thing to say
[20:26:28] <Warren Kumari> May I? <AKA Hand!>
[20:26:44] <Warren Kumari> Actually, hand down....
[20:29:42] <Suzanne Woolf> last call…?
[20:31:18] <Warren Kumari> … and I wanted to say Thank you to the chairs for organizing and running this....
[20:31:31] <ggm> ditto.
[20:31:35] <ggm> thanks for running a meeting.
[20:31:40] <Ralph Droms> Yes, thank you.
[20:32:42] ggm leaves the room
[20:32:43] <Andrew Sullivan> bye!
[20:32:45] <Andrew Sullivan> thanks
[20:32:46] <dnshane> Bye!
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[20:33:03] fneves leaves the room
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[20:34:56] <Suzanne Woolf> Thanks all, see you in Chicago
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