IETF
dnsop
dnsop@jabber.ietf.org
Friday, April 8, 2016< ^ >
DanYork has set the subject to: DNSOP at IETF95
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[12:54:14] <DanYork> Guten Morgen! Wir sind jetzt auf IETF 95 Buenos Aires
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[12:55:22] <DanYork> The second meeting of DNSOP at IETF95 will begin shortly
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[12:56:57] <Peter Koch> Danke, Dan - bekommen wir eine Simultan-Übersetzung? ;-)
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[12:58:05] <DanYork> Herr Koch - Ha!  Leider ist mein Deutsch nicht so gut wie das.
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[12:58:42] <Peter Koch> it's all good, but we're driving away the others ...
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[13:00:28] <Antoin Verschuren> Ach Dan, das ist doch egal! '-)
[13:00:41] joel jaeggli joins the room
[13:00:41] Timothy Morizot joins the room
[13:01:27] <DanYork> :-)
[13:01:28] Craig Taylor joins the room
[13:01:31] <DanYork> Agenda at: https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/95/agenda/dnsop/
[13:01:49] Peter Koch leaves the room
[13:02:04] Andrew Sullivan joins the room
[13:02:06] <DanYork> Chair slides: https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/95/slides/slides-95-dnsop-0.pdf
[13:02:06] Peter Koch joins the room
[13:02:44] <Peter Koch> i'm on the mp3 audio, but white noise only - is it BuenosAyresC?
[13:02:52] Philip Homburg joins the room
[13:03:00] <DanYork> Currently displaying "Agenda, Session Two" - slide 6
[13:03:07] mcr-soho joins the room
[13:03:17] <Peter Koch> now i hear Tim very silently
[13:03:18] <DanYork> Peter Koch: Yes, Buen Ayre C
[13:03:18] Francis Dupont joins the room
[13:03:23] David Lawrence joins the room
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[13:04:21] <Peter Koch> almost unaudible - anybody else have issues?
[13:04:28] Richard Franks joins the room
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[13:04:43] <DanYork> Meetecho: audio is low, can you check?
[13:04:45] <John Klensin> No audio from Meetecho
[13:04:55] <mcr-soho> I have good audio
[13:05:01] <jacques latour> here too
[13:05:06] <ekline> I too can hear fine
[13:05:07] <russmundy@jabber.org> My audiio is okay
[13:05:36] <DanYork> Peter Koch: Is audio still low?
[13:05:47] <Peter Koch> it's 25252, if you're familiar with SINPO codes
[13:05:53] <Peter Koch> low singal, much noise
[13:05:58] <Peter Koch> err, signal
[13:06:17] <Peter Koch> i'm not using the meetecho stream, but the mp3 audio
[13:06:31] <Meetecho> checking that
[13:06:34] <John Klensin> Dan, I don't know if my problem and Peter's are related, but I'm getting no audio at all Signal=Noise=0
[13:06:39] Peter van Dijk joins the room
[13:06:39] <aaron> some there are remote folks here?
[13:06:46] <aaron> sigh
[13:06:52] <aaron> are there remote folks here?
[13:06:54] <John Klensin> And I'm on the meetecho stream.
[13:07:02] <DanYork> Yes, there are remote people here
[13:07:10] <aaron> OK, I don't think the chair's assigned a scribe.  I will do so
[13:07:13] <John Klensin> Yes, Aaron, I"m remote
[13:07:14] <DanYork> Francis Dupont was at mic
[13:07:17] <DanYork> Yes, I'm scribing
[13:07:19] <jacques latour> got snow here, remote enough?
[13:07:22] <aaron> Right, John.  Of course.
[13:07:28] Alexander Mayrhofer joins the room
[13:07:29] <aaron> Warren speaking
[13:07:30] <Peter Koch> much better now!
[13:07:30] <DanYork> Shane Kerr at mic
[13:07:37] <DanYork> Warren Kumari at mic now
[13:07:42] <John Klensin> Will disconnect and try reconnecting.
[13:07:46] <Peter Koch> great!, thanks!
[13:07:52] <DanYork> IF YOU ARE REMOTE and want anything relayed, please says "mic" at the beginning
[13:07:58] John Klensin leaves the room
[13:08:04] <DanYork> Wes Hardaker at mic
[13:08:21] <Richard Franks> Meetecho stream ok for me
[13:08:31] <Andrew Sullivan> What if you're local and want something relayed?  (Sorry, couldn't resist.)
[13:08:34] <DanYork> Olafur at mic
[13:08:46] <DanYork> Andrew Sullivan: Sorry, you have to get up and go to the mic
[13:08:57] <Peter Koch> @Andrew Sullivan: use loopback
[13:09:05] <DanYork> Evan Hunt at mic
[13:09:07] bortzmeyer joins the room
[13:09:29] <DanYork> aaron: Please feel free to add in here!  I may be getting up to speak
[13:09:33] <Andrew Sullivan> Please remember when speaking into the mic that you need to speak into it pretty clearly and closely.  There's a lot of cross-talk from next door and the acoustics here are crap.  And some of us are mostly deaf
[13:09:42] <DanYork> Kazunori Fujiwara at mic
[13:10:03] John Klensin joins the room
[13:10:08] <DanYork> Ray Bellis at mic
[13:10:44] Yoshiro Yoneya joins the room
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[13:11:06] <John Klensin> Ok, that did it... have audio now.
[13:11:28] Kees Monshouwer joins the room
[13:11:55] <DanYork> Slides - https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/95/slides/slides-95-dnsop-8.pdf
[13:12:04] <DanYork> Vincent Levigneron  speaking
[13:12:13] Tomohiro Fujisaki leaves the room
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[13:12:45] <DanYork> Draft: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-wallstrom-dnsop-dns-delegation-requirements/?include_text=1
[13:13:01] <DanYork> Slide 2: Background (Legacy)
[13:13:12] John Levine joins the room
[13:13:40] <bortzmeyer> s/si/se/
[13:14:00] <bortzmeyer> Ad: https://zonemaster.net/
[13:14:06] <DanYork> Slovenia becomes Sweden for a moment
[13:14:19] <DanYork> Slide 3: Background (Zonemaster roots)
[13:14:27] each joins the room
[13:15:12] DanYork suddenly stops paying attention to Vincent after bortzmeyer posts that URL here...
[13:15:14] <DanYork> Slide 4: Background (Zonemaster in 1 slide)
[13:15:43] <bortzmeyer> DanYork: next time, I'll post You Porn URL
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[13:16:15] <DanYork> bortzmeyer: Well, I trusted YOU, so I just clicked your link... you could have sent me anywhere...
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[13:17:08] <DanYork> Slide 5: Background (IANA Requirements)
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[13:18:07] <DanYork> Slide 6: Background (ICANN PDT)
[13:18:41] <DanYork> Slide 7: The draft
[13:19:03] <aaron> zonemaster check of IETF shows DNSSEC failure
[13:19:06] <DanYork> Hmmm... bortzmeyer: running that test on "ietf.org" gives interesting results:  https://zonemaster.net/test/398c74e99d4b5bbb
[13:19:17] <DanYork> aaron: HA!  Great minds think alike! :-)
[13:19:21] <aaron> :D
[13:19:27] <DanYork> "RRSIG with keytag 45586 and covering type(s) DNSKEY has a remaining validity of 28840519 seconds, which is too long. "
[13:20:03] Tomohiro Fujisaki joins the room
[13:20:28] <DanYork> Slide 8: The draft (Organization of document)
[13:20:59] <bortzmeyer> aaron: one year of RRSIG validity is a lot...
[13:21:09] <bortzmeyer> DanYork: fear the replay attack
[13:21:18] Tomohiro Fujisaki leaves the room
[13:21:30] <DanYork> Kudos to the authors of the slides in HAVING SLIDE NUMBERS on their slides.  Simple nice thing that makes it easier for jabber scribes.
[13:22:02] <bortzmeyer> And also, a TTL of half-hour on a RRSIG with a validity of one year is funny :-)
[13:22:17] <DanYork> bortzmeyer: Ha!  Yes, that's odd.
[13:22:48] <DanYork> Slide 10: The draft (enhancements)
[13:22:53] <DanYork> Slide 11: The draft
[13:23:34] <DanYork> Ralf Weber at mic
[13:23:51] Hugo Kobayashi joins the room
[13:24:13] <DanYork> Paul Hoffman at mic
[13:25:15] <Peter Koch> did Paul say BCP is Standards Track?
[13:26:44] Ralph joins the room
[13:26:45] <DanYork> Dan York
[13:27:00] <DanYork> Dan and Paul discussed MUSTs and SHOULDs
[13:27:04] <DanYork> Dave Conrad at mic
[13:27:20] <DanYork> s/Dave/David/
[13:27:49] <DanYork> John Levine at mic
[13:27:57] Pieter Lexis joins the room
[13:28:36] <DanYork> Stuart at mic
[13:28:47] <DanYork> Paul Hoffman at mic
[13:29:02] <DanYork> (Stuart Cheshire)
[13:29:27] <DanYork> Marcos Sanz at mic
[13:29:34] <DanYork> Andrew Sullivan at mic
[13:30:37] Jim Galvin joins the room
[13:31:04] <russmundy@jabber.org> +1 to what Andrew just said
[13:31:11] <DanYork> Andrew Sullivan gets the curmudgeon-of-the-day award: "the chance of this document being published will approach zero"
[13:31:18] <DanYork> David Conrad at mic
[13:31:23] Tomohiro Fujisaki joins the room
[13:31:24] <each> another +1 to andrew
[13:31:55] <bortzmeyer> Some document which was not mentioned yet http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc7720.txt
[13:32:34] Tomohiro Fujisaki leaves the room
[13:33:02] <Peter Koch> mic: can the authors figure what the non-controversial set of tests is?
[13:35:28] <DanYork> Dan York at mic
[13:35:32] <DanYork> Shane Kerr at mic
[13:35:58] Tomohiro Fujisaki joins the room
[13:36:08] <Richard Franks> hummmmm
[13:36:17] <George Mundy> hmm
[13:36:45] <Andrew Sullivan> I am prepared to support others' attempts to try again!
[13:36:48] <Andrew Sullivan> I think it'd be great
[13:36:52] <DanYork> Slides: https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/95/slides/slides-95-dnsop-2.pdf
[13:36:53] Suzanne joins the room
[13:36:55] <Andrew Sullivan> I just observe how well it went last time
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[13:36:58] <DanYork> Paul Wouters speaking
[13:37:28] <jacques latour> point camera to front
[13:37:37] <DanYork> Slide 2: Updating Algorithm Requirements Levels
[13:37:38] Trouble Maker joins the room
[13:37:47] <DanYork> Meetecho: Can you please change the camera?
[13:38:01] <Meetecho> catching up on that (y)
[13:38:10] each joins the room
[13:38:11] <ekline> (thanks)
[13:38:15] <Suzanne> @ajs, the trauma lingers
[13:38:25] <DanYork> Slides 3 and 4 ... the list of algorithms
[13:38:35] <DanYork> Paul Hoffman at mic
[13:38:48] Ralph leaves the room
[13:38:49] Ralph joins the room
[13:39:18] <mcr-soho> mic: I am for doing this work, and this split for signers/validators is sane and good.  I see that you would pick validation SHOULD+ in advance of signer SHOULD+, and I think this makes sense.
[13:39:42] <DanYork> Christian Huitema at mic
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[13:40:15] <each> my brain is now wasting cycles trying to figure out what "MUST+" would mean
[13:40:45] <mcr-soho> each, we have prior art for this in S/MIME and IPsecME.
[13:41:29] <bortzmeyer> each: means MUST today and YOUWILLBURNINHELLIFYOUDONOTDOIT soon
[13:41:41] <each> sorry, dan, I was kidding, that wasn't a serious question :)
[13:41:44] <mcr-soho> SHOULD+ means it is going towards MUST, while MUST- is downward trending to SHOULD.
[13:41:50] cheshire joins the room
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[13:42:06] <DanYork> each: I know you were kidding... but my brain was spinning, too :-)
[13:42:08] <mcr-soho> you can't trend above MUST, which is why + doesn't make sense.
[13:42:08] aaron loving the arrival of NewSpeak in the IETF
[13:42:14] <each> bortzmeyer: I thought we used THOU SHALT for that
[13:42:27] <DanYork> mcr-soho: Yes, I realize that
[13:43:07] <DanYork> I just happened to vocalize that thinking before by brain had figured it out.  :-)
[13:43:27] <Andrew Sullivan> I agree, the discussion of specifics on list.  Can't we just decide whether this strategy is good?
[13:43:33] <DanYork> Christian Huitema at mic
[13:43:59] Jorge Cano joins the room
[13:44:13] <DanYork> Paul Hoffman at mic
[13:44:27] <DanYork> But it's April, not May
[13:44:39] <mcr-soho> mic: if your only interoperable algorithm is marked SHOULD-, then you had better add a new algorithm, because later on others may remove support for it, and you won't interoperate.
[13:44:54] <bortzmeyer> DanYork: April is May- (currently april but soon may)
[13:44:58] <each> haha
[13:45:07] <DanYork> Perfect
[13:45:09] Kees Monshouwer leaves the room
[13:45:11] <each> MAY be may
[13:45:14] Tomohiro Fujisaki leaves the room
[13:45:24] <mcr-soho> DanYork, no actually that's not the case. June is May-. April is May+.
[13:45:33] bortzmeyer is sad that engineers have trouble thinking in the fourth dimension (time)
[13:45:33] Tomohiro Fujisaki joins the room
[13:45:53] <dyork> Oh, man...
[13:46:05] <Francis Dupont> as suggested privately by Paul Hoffman I'll continue the RSASHA512 SHOULD- discuss on the list.
[13:46:37] <John Klensin> Let's see, "you MAY SHOULD"  (or is that "may SHOULD" or "MAY should"?  I do actually agree with Paul Hoffman but, especially revisions to 2119 under discussion a present,  this discussion could easily turn into a rathole tour.'
[13:47:32] <mcr-soho> dan, I think my previous mic: is relevant to the discussion.
[13:47:40] <mcr-soho> RFC6994 I think he said.
[13:48:22] <Andrew Sullivan> The last time we did this, we ended up with https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6944
[13:48:32] Tomohiro Fujisaki leaves the room
[13:48:36] <mcr-soho> RFC6944. just to repeat.
[13:49:25] <Andrew Sullivan> We started, when working on that, with exactly the SHOULD+ and so on that the people who actually regularly work on algorithms around the IETF were using
[13:49:38] <Andrew Sullivan> people objected, so then we came up with a whole bunch of other stuff
[13:49:55] <Andrew Sullivan> and then we ended up with this applicability statement
[13:50:12] <Andrew Sullivan> which didn't even have the guidance-for-future-by-guessing
[13:50:48] <Andrew Sullivan> that guidance to future was explicitly one of the things some objected to, IIRC.  I bet that particular discussion was captured in the datatracker because there was a long-running DISCUSS against 6944 too
[13:51:09] Juan P. Cerezo leaves the room
[13:51:17] <DanYork> Slides: https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/95/slides/slides-95-dnsop-3.pdf
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[13:51:41] <DanYork> Andrew Sullivan presenting
[13:52:09] <DanYork> Slide 2: The problem
[13:52:10] Trouble Maker leaves the room
[13:52:24] <DanYork> "CLASS is vestigal, like your appendix"
[13:53:00] <jacques latour> Dan: appendix A or B
[13:53:18] <DanYork> "If you actually tried to use classes, they don't work"
[13:53:28] <DanYork> "the attractive nuisances problem"
[13:53:54] aaron leaves the room
[13:54:05] Alexander Mayrhofer leaves the room
[13:54:32] <John Klensin> MIC: Chaos was a "different network stack", Hesiod was something else, more like a hierarchical namespace.  If either "didn't work", it would come as a surprise to a lot of users at the time. "outlived their usefulness and are creating confusion" would make me a lot happier than "useless".
[13:55:20] aaron joins the room
[13:55:35] <DanYork> Christian Huitema at mic
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[13:56:05] <mcr-soho> actually a good idea.
[13:56:16] <DanYork> Olafur at mic
[13:56:18] <each> "entropy does not need your help" - my mother in law
[13:58:01] Alexander Mayrhofer joins the room
[13:58:02] <DanYork> John Levine at mic
[13:58:52] Juan P. Cerezo joins the room
[13:59:03] alain durand joins the room
[13:59:05] Reymer A Vargas-Solano joins the room
[13:59:11] <DanYork> Mark Andrews at mic
[13:59:40] sara@sinodun.com joins the room
[13:59:42] <DanYork> Mark: "we don't need to close CLASS, we need to make it usable in the future"
[14:00:36] <Peter Koch> mic: with the CLASS registry closed, sth like RFC 2136 would not be possible; registration policy already sets a high bar; bad ideas will not go away by closing the registry
[14:01:09] Wes George joins the room
[14:01:21] <bortzmeyer> Peter Koch: i don't get the relationship with dynamic updates
[14:01:33] <each> we use class CHAOS for version.bind, authors.bind and id.server, but I don't know of any other current use
[14:01:42] <Peter Koch> mic+: class dependent RRTYPE definitions are a different issue
[14:02:18] <dyork> Will relay
[14:02:24] <bortzmeyer> Mark sees things that mere mortals do not see :-)
[14:02:27] Wes George leaves the room
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[14:03:28] <Peter Koch> appears I find myself in agreement with marka
[14:03:42] <DanYork> Peter Koch: you said "sth like RFC 2136" ... "things like RFC2136"
[14:03:53] <John Klensin> You could take your (pictured) anvil and drop it on the bad idea fairy with a suggestion that he write that I-D (and give him some hints about the hard part).  :-)
[14:04:04] <Peter Koch> @DanYork, indeed, tnx
[14:06:21] <aaron> CLASS=ONION
[14:06:27] Tomohiro Fujisaki joins the room
[14:07:04] <ekline> those ramifications include all the things that go with namespace collisions
[14:07:25] <Peter Koch> well, that's why bundling doesn't work ;-)
[14:07:27] <ekline> sullivan++
[14:09:23] <John Klensin> Yes!
[14:10:10] <DanYork> Stephane Bortzmeyer at mic
[14:10:10] alain durand leaves the room
[14:10:44] <aaron>     what is he referring to?  net40?
[14:11:00] <each> I'm not sure how this would affect other implementations, but BIND implements views as class-specific: a query for class=anything-but-IN cannot be answered by a zone in an IN view.
[14:11:07] <John Klensin> MIC: Seems to me that fixing the spec to remove the parallel tree language and restrict cross-class RRTYPEs would be straightforward.  I'd even volunteer to do the work, right after we get i18n nailed down.
[14:11:08] Alain Durand joins the room
[14:11:30] <each> it would take a pretty significant rewrite to make BIND able to use classes in any significant way
[14:11:38] <DanYork> David Lawrence at mic
[14:12:03] <John Klensin> The "they aren't used anyway" argument actually suggests such a change is possible.
[14:12:05] <bortzmeyer> aaron: net4d.org (domain dead now)
[14:12:19] <aaron> @bortzmeyer: thanks
[14:12:37] Trouble Maker leaves the room
[14:12:37] <John Klensin> Wasn't suggesting changing any software -- that would be the problem of anyone who wanted to use the thing... and we should make that really clear.
[14:12:48] <bortzmeyer> aaron: http://www.bortzmeyer.org/net4d.html (french only)
[14:13:15] <DanYork> Joel Jaeggli at mic
[14:14:04] <DanYork> Slides: https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/95/slides/slides-95-dnsop-9.pdf
[14:14:09] <DanYork> Olafur presenting
[14:14:17] <DanYork> AAAA4free & Black Lies
[14:14:34] <David Lawrence> bortzmeyer: a dead domain name is unfortunately an incomplete answer
[14:14:50] Tomohiro Fujisaki leaves the room
[14:14:55] <bortzmeyer> David Lawrence: that's why I also posted the URL of my analysis of this project
[14:15:58] <Andrew Sullivan> That warm, sucking thing around your foot is not quicksand, Olafur,
[14:16:05] <Andrew Sullivan> but it is kinda brown.
[14:16:05] <DanYork> Slide 2: Black Lies: negative answer with one NSEC record
[14:16:21] <DanYork> Slide 3: "Black Lies" in action
[14:16:55] <DanYork> Slide 4: Walking Black lies
[14:17:11] <DanYork> Slide 5: Implementation experience
[14:17:41] DanYork notices that Olafur is complying with corporate branding with both his shirt and slides
[14:18:00] <DanYork> Slide 6: Documenting practice
[14:18:04] <DanYork> David Lawrence at mic
[14:18:54] <DanYork> Paul Hoffman at mic
[14:19:49] Ralph leaves the room
[14:19:52] <DanYork> Aaron Falk at mic
[14:20:17] <DanYork> Mark Andrews at mic
[14:20:44] <DanYork> Mark: "this interacts very badly with aggressive negative caching"
[14:22:28] <DanYork> For a moment, I thought Mark said "the spice is nearly infinite" and experienced a Dune flashback.  (He said "the *space*...")
[14:22:46] Ralph joins the room
[14:23:14] <DanYork> Olafur is moving on to talk about "AAAA4free == A+AAAA" on slide 7
[14:23:27] <DanYork> (and switched from a black to white background)
[14:23:28] each leaves the room
[14:23:50] <DanYork> Stuart Cheshire at mic
[14:24:29] <DanYork> "when you say 'poison' you mean 'preload with true information' versus 'preload with false information'" - Stuart
[14:24:34] <Peter Koch> anybody else hear the woodpecker on the audio?
[14:24:42] <Peter Koch> gone, tnx
[14:25:26] Juan P. Cerezo leaves the room
[14:25:29] <DanYork> Slide 8: Questions:
[14:25:44] Juan P. Cerezo joins the room
[14:25:54] <David Lawrence> haha @ infinite spice
[14:26:43] <DanYork> Andrew Sullivan at mic
[14:27:50] <ekline> mic: is there any data that suggests this actually saves RTTs (for non-validating clients, say...)?  Many resolvers ask for AAAA first, if IPv6 is a possibility for the client.
[14:28:17] <DanYork> Robert Martin-Legene at mic
[14:28:36] <DanYork> ekline: is that "Eric Kline"?
[14:28:41] <ekline> yes
[14:28:43] <DanYork> Ed Lewis at mic
[14:28:59] <ekline> DanYork: 'tis I
[14:29:16] <DanYork> ?
[14:29:35] <ekline> (ekline == Erik Kline, Google Japan, ...)
[14:29:49] <DanYork> Paul Wouters at mic
[14:30:03] <DanYork> Shane Kerr at mic
[14:31:19] <Andrew Sullivan> There's no question it'd be a win, and I think it would be nice.  I also thought it would have been nice the last several times the idea came up, and every other time we decided that the interoperability problem without signalling was too bad
[14:31:45] <DanYork> Stuart Cheshire at mic
[14:32:03] <DanYork> Erik Nygren at mic
[14:32:17] <Andrew Sullivan> I just don't buy the argument that signalling isn't worth it.  Indeed, the argument you might get better performance would be a reason to buy less-stupid middleboxes
[14:32:33] <Andrew Sullivan> and we could promote that as "low latency home router" or whatever
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[14:32:42] <ray> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bellis-dnsext-multi-qtypes-01
[14:32:45] <DanYork> Christian Huitema at mic
[14:33:04] <Andrew Sullivan> I observe that this group has a hard time understanding "mic line closed" ;-)
[14:33:33] <DanYork> Andrew Sullivan: Indeed!  There is just some latency in query response times
[14:34:51] <DanYork> Now moving into special names problem statement
[14:34:57] <DanYork> Slides: https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/95/slides/slides-95-dnsop-10.pdf
[14:35:46] <Peter Koch> what were the rough numbers?
[14:35:59] <Suzanne> I just hate to cut off operators having useful discussions about DNS in DNSOP
[14:36:08] <Peter Koch> :-)
[14:36:30] <DanYork> Peter Koch: numbers in terms of people who read the drafts?
[14:36:54] <DanYork> Slide 2: Three Streams Form a River
[14:36:55] <Suzanne> Sorry Peter, didn't comment clearly enough: not that many have read either the rev -02 of your draft, or the new one.
[14:37:05] <Peter Koch> thanks, suz
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[14:37:53] <DanYork> Slide: The Name Space: a Commons
[14:38:54] <Andrew Sullivan> It is really hard for me to hear Warren over the loud person next door
[14:40:05] <DanYork> Andrew Sullivan: I've long wondered if we need an I-D on 'how to properly speak into a microphone" ...
[14:41:22] <DanYork> Dan York at mic
[14:41:27] <DanYork> Stuart Cheshire at mic
[14:42:13] <DanYork> Who was it in ARCING that suggested we should bring back the UUCP bang-path?
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[14:42:19] <John Klensin> Perhaps we could solve part of this problem with CLASS=Special ? :-)
[14:42:53] <DanYork> John Klensin: Ha!
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[14:45:20] <mcr-soho> we can hear.
[14:45:23] <Alain Durand> we can hear you
[14:45:26] <ekline> can hear and watch just fine, actually
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[14:45:42] <mcr-soho> but, they can't see our message too.
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[14:46:11] <mcr-soho> suddendly, warren's laptop starts answering mDNS for www.google.com <http://www.google.com>
[14:46:13] <Peter Koch> IETF special rooms
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[14:49:19] <Suzanne> on-site net is back
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[14:49:48] <bortzmeyer> Wifi is back
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[14:50:46] <DanYork> We're back...
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[14:51:07] <mcr-soho> so, no kick backs from icann to support glibc :-)
[14:51:10] <DanYork> <a bunch of people were at the mic>
[14:51:19] <DanYork> David Conrad at mic
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[14:52:37] <DanYork> Suzanne putting herself in the queue
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[14:54:13] <DanYork> Ralph Droms at mic
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[14:55:14] <Peter Koch> mic: i take offense in being accused of co-conspiring protecting ICANN's income; this is not about ICANN, it's about the IETF behaving consistent: consistent with the architecture, consistent with the 2860 MoU and consistent with the 6761 procedure to start with; also we do have identified open issues in 6761 - and that was the task
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[14:56:33] <DanYork> Stuart Cheshire at mic
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[14:57:12] <Peter Koch> thanks
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[14:58:41] <ekline> Thanks DanYork!
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[14:58:46] <DanYork> And we're done
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[14:59:07] <Peter Koch> thanks again, Dan!
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[14:59:52] <DanYork> Bitte schön, Herr Koch
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[15:00:02] <DanYork> Bye until Berlin
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