[08:14:56] Toby M joins the room [08:15:17] Toby M leaves the room: I'm happy Miranda IM user. Get it at http://miranda-im.org/. [10:43:49] Toby M joins the room [10:58:51] Simon Leinen joins the room [11:00:47] jlcJohn joins the room [11:01:42] coopdanger joins the room [11:03:28] YJS joins the room [11:03:45] Matt Zekauskas joins the room [11:03:53] mattmathis joins the room [11:04:17] eburger joins the room [11:04:26] Your humble Jabber scribe, Eric here [11:04:34] How many of you are remote? [11:04:37] hi! [11:04:40] i'm remote... [11:05:01] Thanks. Can you hear the audio? [11:05:09] yes. very clear [11:05:11] Thanks. [11:05:21] Active WG items slide [11:06:09] Missed date for Conex concepts and use cases [11:06:44] unfortunately i can't find the WGC slides anywhere online [11:07:08] Oooh - I don't see thme, either. [11:07:18] Talking about draft-krishnan-conex-ipv6-02 & mods to TCP [11:07:23] now up to the first presentation [11:07:34] http://tools.ietf.org/agenda/80/slides/conex-1.ppt [11:07:43] Bob Briscoe up to the stage [11:07:53] SwedeMike joins the room [11:08:30] Title slide [11:08:45] leslie joins the room [11:09:03] slide 2: context seting [11:10:45] Slide 3: basic signals and functional units [11:12:10] this was an excellent slide, wish this was available quite a while ago. [11:12:20] tleva joins the room [11:12:32] in various forms that picture has existed. but the problem is converting it to ASCII! [11:12:46] Slide 4 [11:14:59] Need as many credits as credits want to get [11:15:03] rscheff joins the room [11:15:05] Do we want to put this into the draft? [11:15:12] olafbergmann joins the room [11:15:30] leslie leaves the room [11:15:38] Bob: probably. Want to give guidelines, but had to figure out what people have (policies) [11:16:58] Mikele at mic [11:17:05] Georgio at mic [11:17:32] Audit function counts # of packet losses; counting / examining sequence #'s [11:17:39] Policy not mentioned. [11:18:06] Won't policy function have some influence on how we determine how congested network do? [11:18:24] malc joins the room [11:18:31] Bob: need to give examples of policy function in text. Audit function, however, is much more constrained. [11:19:07] no [11:19:54] @ Matt: want me to channel something for you? [11:20:07] no I have too much delay in the audio [11:20:21] k [11:21:02] sureshk joins the room [11:21:14] On to change to TCP ECN feedback bullet on Slide 4 [11:22:55] leslie joins the room [11:23:50] On to monitoring function bullet on Slide 4 [11:24:24] slide 5: added whole subsection [11:26:39] flow state? I was instructed on the list earlier today that there was no flow state in conex? [11:26:48] Slide 7 [11:26:58] flow state only needed for audit... [11:27:00] Want me to bring that up? [11:27:05] never mind [11:27:14] that is discussed in the draft... [11:28:57] Mirje at mic [11:30:26] tmonca: so audit is optional? I'm reading 4.3 and it doesn't really say. [11:30:40] could we remind people at the mic about saying name and affiliation [11:30:51] will do. at least name ;-) [11:31:06] Last voice was our chair [11:31:42] @SwedeMike: this is where it starts to get more complex. Audit needed for some uses of ConEx [11:32:08] it depends on whether the sender would get an advantage from misdeclaring conex signal [11:32:47] David Carsen at mic [11:33:02] David McDysan [11:33:05] that mic is very quiet [11:33:09] oops :-) [11:33:16] thanks [11:33:25] I'm having difficulty hearing questioners [11:33:26] np. I mostly don't know, happy to help :) [11:34:28] ???: sender or received needs to measure rate of lost packets; not a requirement in document [11:34:37] Bob: makes sense, as some transports don't do that [11:35:21] ???: TCP has some feedback mechanisms, how will we document this? [11:35:28] Bob: protocol-specific drafts [11:37:04] sureshk leaves the room [11:37:38] Slide 8 [11:39:30] http://tools.ietf.org/agenda/80/slides/conex-1.ppt coming [11:39:40] Nandita at mic [11:40:04] I meant http://tools.ietf.org/agenda/80/slides/conex-2.pdf is next [11:41:16] more work definitely needed [11:41:20] Questions? [11:41:27] Philip at mic [11:41:48] Slide 7 #4 referenced: Some networks use ConEX signals, others dont [11:42:40] Mirje at mic [11:43:48] ConEx Concepts and Use Cases draft-ietf-conex-concepts-uses-01 [11:44:18] David McDysan [11:44:33] Slide: Outline [11:45:06] Slide: Status of Changes Requested at Beijing [11:47:16] New section on longer time scale in -01 [11:50:08] Joe at mic [11:50:16] georgios even [11:50:19] Will shaper be able to identify each flow? [11:50:24] ack [11:50:45] audio just died? [11:50:54] yes. [11:50:55] Do you hear Georgio? [11:50:56] cutting in and out [11:51:05] Can you hear David? [11:51:10] audio just quit [11:51:14] stream died. [11:51:15] and I was getting silly delay - going to try restarting the audio stream [11:51:15] :-( [11:51:27] let me try to reach secretariat [11:51:28] tmonca: doesn't help for me, I just tried. [11:52:08] New items from mailing list [11:53:14] Any better? I just dropped a note to the secretariat [11:53:25] still nothing [11:53:27] stream is still dead, get error message when trying to connect [11:53:30] Marje at mic [11:53:51] ditto here - "file not found" when trying to open stream [11:54:13] mine says "location not found" [11:55:15] i just tried another stream which is also dead - suggests the server died or something [11:55:20] Let me know if/when it comes back [11:55:43] Simon Leinen leaves the room [11:56:05] Rich Woundy @ mic [11:56:07] anyone send anything to mtd@ietf.org? [11:56:11] I just did [11:56:14] k [11:56:14] now it's working! [11:56:18] Yay! [11:56:20] see? :) [11:56:36] so where are we now? [11:56:48] Still very hard to hear questioner mike [11:56:54] Still talking about Concepts & Use cases [11:57:00] jpc joins the room [11:57:26] better now? [11:57:31] yes [11:57:45] just adjusted mic stand [11:58:00] still Rich Woundy @ mic [11:58:04] it's clear for me, volume is a bit different, but I raise it a bit and I can hear everybody fine. [11:59:05] rscheff leaves the room [11:59:24] Simon Leinen joins the room [12:00:05] Nandita at mic [12:01:20] Alyssa Cooper at mic [12:02:00] sureshk joins the room [12:02:39] Can i make a comment as an author? [12:02:46] sure [12:02:51] want me to go to mic? [12:03:01] but getting a bit late... [12:03:05] namely, I think we do need stuff on timescales, but perhaps not in the form it is in in section 6. [12:03:14] NM - we're moving on I hear [12:03:20] right. [12:03:24] Slide 6 [12:08:54] Dave at mic [12:09:18] Philip at mic [12:09:49] Can you hear Bob talking? [12:09:56] I hear everybody fine. [12:10:53] Mirje at mic [12:11:11] Alyssa at mic [12:11:13] NO. it will have a new section [12:12:19] Toby - want me to say so? [12:12:32] no, don;'t worry [12:12:39] you've got the pen, after all :-) [12:12:55] lol i know, so i get to say what happens... ;) [12:13:06] :-) [12:14:03] who? [12:14:18] Obviously Marcelo [12:14:25] correct [12:14:35] sureshk leaves the room [12:14:57] Conex IPv6 format [12:14:58] rscheff joins the room [12:15:05] http://tools.ietf.org/agenda/80/slides/conex-0.ppt [12:15:11] Suresh Krishnan [12:15:34] Slide 2 [12:16:29] slide 3 [12:17:08] Bob at mic [12:17:31] conex not about routers, but about policy [12:17:40] Suresh: s/router/intermediate node/g [12:18:13] I have to agree with Suresh, I don't see how this can not be done in a router. A router does routing and queueing, and it's all called a router [12:21:24] Bob at mic [12:21:57] We've been on slide 4. sorry about that [12:22:03] (the bingo box) [12:22:22] slide 5 [12:22:29] discussion of Destination Options [12:22:33] Channel please: DSCP in header is legal [12:23:14] couldn't hear that last thing. [12:23:22] Yes, DSCP is legal. [12:23:27] Then blank stare [12:23:51] Andrew at mic [12:24:46] Brian at mic [12:25:05] YJS leaves the room [12:26:07] Andrew again at mic [12:26:18] Dave at mic [12:26:30] Would be good to get Brian to interpret the "must accept in any order"... [12:26:51] the destinations options are really addressed to the tunnel endpoint [12:27:31] he will say must accept in any order = any order must accept [12:27:37] (I feel like it's anagram time) [12:28:04] Dave at mic [12:28:09] wouldn't all routers have to be conex-aware generally? so it basically means destination headers all of a sudden has to be looked at by all routers? [12:28:35] there seems to be ~5-10s delay on the audio stream [12:28:57] who is mikaabra? (for channeling) [12:29:03] eburger: Mikael Abrahamsson [12:30:31] Bob at mic [12:32:15] Andrew McGreggor again at mic [12:33:48] Mirje [12:35:41] I guess I really ought to properly learn IPv6! I got a bit lost just now... [12:35:49] :-) [12:36:02] Bob saying it would be good to try [12:37:12] Mirje at mic [12:38:56] if someone has code, I can provide a test endpoint in my network. I can setup a cisco ipsec tunnel between two cisco routers running current code. [12:39:10] rscheff leaves the room [12:39:30] Andrew at mic [12:41:04] i think dest options sounds a feasible way forward... [12:41:11] Not qualified to say if it's best or not! [12:41:26] Teco at mic [12:41:27] (sp?) [12:42:21] Wes at mic [12:44:51] Dirk on Mobile Communication Congestion Exposure Scenario http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-kutscher-conex-mobile/ [12:45:06] http://tools.ietf.org/agenda/80/slides/conex-4.ppt [12:46:35] Slide 2 [12:46:52] rscheff joins the room [12:47:34] Slide 3 [12:48:26] Slide 4 [12:48:54] leslie leaves the room [12:51:01] slide 5/6 [12:51:30] leslie joins the room [12:51:34] slide 7 [12:54:38] slide 8 [12:54:46] slide 9 [12:55:28] slide 10 [12:56:50] Channel: have you thought about implementing in Destination Options, or have you been thinking DSCP, or some other magic? [12:57:08] Out of time :-( [12:57:13] send to list [12:58:30] Usage/Volume Tier Feedback Use Case for Congestion Exposure draft-mcdysan-conex-volumetier-usecase-00 Dave McDysan [12:58:39] http://tools.ietf.org/agenda/80/slides/conex-3.pdf [12:59:04] slide 6 [12:59:13] olafbergmann leaves the room [12:59:59] leslie leaves the room [13:00:03] leslie joins the room [13:00:15] Is someone in the jabber room in the physical room? I need to get to a meeting... [13:00:42] wave [13:00:46] I'll stay till the end [13:00:50] slide 9 [13:00:53] Thanks!!!! [13:00:55] eburger leaves the room [13:01:49] Matt, the good will is what counts :-) [13:01:54] nandita closes, please take discussion on the list [13:01:55] :) [13:02:01] leslie leaves the room [13:02:07] rscheff leaves the room: Computer went to sleep [13:02:18] Matt Zekauskas leaves the room [13:02:33] Toby M leaves the room: I'm happy Miranda IM user. Get it at http://miranda-im.org/. 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